Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Post Info TOPIC: REALLY? A Bag Tax?!?


2011 Super Bowl Champions!

Status: Offline
Posts: 29950
Date:
REALLY? A Bag Tax?!?


MSNBC is reporting that the city of San Francisco is considering a "Bag Tax" on all shoppers (food stores included) that use paper OR plastic bags for their items!


The tree huggers are claiming that too many trees are cut down for the paper bags and the plastic bags create numerous environmental problems.


Personally, this sounds ridiculous to me, but apparantly it's been done in other countries and the person leading the charge says we need to think "outside the bag" (oh how cute ).


Anyway, I'm curious, what do you all think?


Would you be willing to pay the tax?  Or would you simply drive outside the city to get your groceries?


If you could avoid the tax by say bringing your own reusable plastic crates would that be acceptable to you?


You know, I have one thought, we as humans take in fresh air and exhale air that is completely unusable to other humans.  Perhaps this too is an environmental crisis we should be taxing?  Perhaps we need to start charging a nickel per breath!  Would you be willing to slow down your breathing?


 



__________________


2011 Super Bowl Champions!

Status: Offline
Posts: 29950
Date:

Original Article:


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6870442/



__________________


Grand Poobah

    



Status: Offline
Posts: 36897
Date:

I think people would just grab empty boxes out of the isles like they do at the discount grocery stores, where they already pay for bags. The Fleecing of America will continue. 

__________________
"And like Web, I enjoy throwing JR under the bus.  Problem is, it's usually under the special bus that I ride every day". Ghostdancer 12-18-09


2011 Super Bowl Champions!

Status: Offline
Posts: 29950
Date:

That's a good point JD!


I worked in a grocery store for years, the amount of cardboard we went through was astonishing.  I wonder how many trees it takes to produce all of that?!!


I'm a little more understanding on the plastic bag issue, but come on, paper is a recyclable commodity, ENOUGH ALREADY!



__________________


Phat Cat EL Presidente

    



Status: Offline
Posts: 12975
Date:

First they decided to make bags out of recycled materials, now this isn't good enough? I can't even get my BigMac in a styrofoam container to keep it hot any more (I live 8 miles from the  nearest McDonalds) so it makes bringing food home almost impossible. But now they are wanting to mess with my priveledged choice of paper or plastic? Next thing they are going to do is a rubber tax. Every time your wheels make a rotation they will tax you.

__________________
Sometimes, when i'm lonely... i crawl into a laundry basket and tickle my ears. But, Some times I don't...


2011 Super Bowl Champions!

Status: Offline
Posts: 29950
Date:

I KNOW!


Can't these people find a better cause?  Why not devote their efforts to finding a cure for Cancer, or Alzheimers, or any of the other devastating diseases this country has.  Why waste so much time trying to limit our use of PAPER AND PLASTIC FREAKING BAGS!


The scary thing is, if this thing flies in San Francisco, other cities and states will start looking at it, because they'll ALL want a peice of the newfound revenue source.


And that's ALL it is, another revenue source to continue providing the exact same service they already provide.



__________________


The Procrastinating Red-Head

Status: Offline
Posts: 1433
Date:

In Germany, you have to pay for your bags.  It encourages you to reuse your bags or, better yet, get a mesh one that will not wear out.  However, it's a little different over there and I think this is the point that they are missing in California.  In Germany, people go to the market every day or every other day.  It's convenient to do so.  Where I live, I go once a week, if not every two weeks.  I live at least half an hour from the nearest grocery store.  I can't make that trek every day and work.  Somethings gotta give.  I come home with at least 10 - 15 bags.  They usually come home with one.  There's a big difference there and I don't think they have taken the cultural aspect into it.  I don't know if you have an Aldi's near you, but you have to pay for your bags there.  It's a german company. 


Sparky, I'm feeling for you on the 8 miles, but man, I live a HALF HOUR away from civilization.  My dad's long running joke that they pipe in sunlight to us seems more and more true every day. 


When I was in high school, I started a petition to make the egg cartons out of recyclable material instead of the styrofoam.  I collected over 500 signatures from the kids in our school and sent it off.  A guy from James River Corporation called and said he appreciated the concern and that he would love to come talk to our school about recycling.  Unfortunately, our prep a#s student council wouldn't approve it.  I was so angry.  I'm not a tree hugger, but I wish they had recycling in our area.  I save my aluminum cans and recycle those, but in that's all I can do.  They don't have plastic recycling where I live. 


My sister lives in Germany and it is mandatory that you recycle.  5 separate classes of recycling.  I don't know what they all are, but she has 5 different bins for her trash and if it's not separated, you pay a lot more and can get a fine.   



__________________
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you do criticize them you will be a mile away and have their shoes.


2011 Super Bowl Champions!

Status: Offline
Posts: 29950
Date:

It's getting that way in my community too Trish, we already recycle paper and plastic, but every year the common council discusses breaking it down into even more catagories. 


They're talking about a bin for biodegradable waste, seperating the paper into 3 categories, and keeping aluminum and plastic seperate (right now it all goes into one bag).


We have to pay for the recycle bags ourselves, and we're doing the seperation work ourselves, when the hell do the taxes start declining?  What exactly ARE we paying them to do anymore other than hall the stuff away?


And the cities are actually PROFITING further from the division of this stuff because they turn around and sell it to the recycle companies.


So why not cut out the $20 an hour middle man city worker and just let the various recycling agencies come and take our plastic, aluminum and paper?  And since they're getting it for only the cost of picking it up, we can make hauling our trash away part of the deal!



__________________


Phat Cat EL Presidente

    



Status: Offline
Posts: 12975
Date:

Trish, Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the recycling, I too recycle cans and plastic and even newspaper but there are comparible materials to styrofoam that are biodegradable that would keep my Big Mac hot.

__________________
Sometimes, when i'm lonely... i crawl into a laundry basket and tickle my ears. But, Some times I don't...


Chairwoman Of The Board

Status: Offline
Posts: 665
Date:

Honestly, I'm surprised Wisconsin hasn't jumped on this bandwagon.  We seem to tax everything here at a huge rate (ie gas tax, stadium tax)...why not keep going?


The whole bag tax thing in San Fran doesn't come as a shock, and frankly, I'm amazed it hasn't happened already. The city is wonderful, a great place to visit, but I will say, it's like living in a country all its own. They can do a lot of things that most cities would balk at.  The folks that live there (my older brother included) absolutely love it, so it's all a matter of taste.


 



__________________
Thank you for being a friend!
CP


Lord of the Lair

Status: Offline
Posts: 4763
Date:

You are right.  Where does the taxing stop?  I got a raise just a short time ago.  I thought it was wonderful, until I got my check.  The raise actually had me taking home less money.


A bag tax.  Absurd--next is toll booths to enter your neighborhood or take a walk down the sidewalk dropping a nickel at every corner to raise the gate.


 



__________________
Zim


Chairwoman Of The Board

Status: Offline
Posts: 758
Date:

Ah well, I used the bags for kitty litter collection - so I might as well pay a little something for them. I just wish I wasn't so cynical that I felt half my tax money was lining some politician's pocket.

__________________


The Procrastinating Red-Head

Status: Offline
Posts: 1433
Date:

I used to work for Smurfit Stone Container Corporation, which used to be Jefferson Smurfit, which is a big recycling company.  We did the trash bills for major companies like Baker's Square, Limited, Gap, J.C. Penney, Fazoli's, Petsmart, etc.  I've dealt with a lot of these trash companies. 


You have basically two problems when it comes to trash collection.  We're running out of landfill space.  Every time you have to shut one down and open a new one, the people who haul your trash are charged more to dump there, which, in turn, gets passed on to you.  It's out of control.  We are dumping way too much trash. 


The other problem is (and I've noticed this in places in Wisconsin, too) that there are some cities that are franchised, which means that you have a selected hauler who has an agreement with the city and they are the only ones who can haul your trash.  They have you by the cajones then.  They can set whatever rate they want and until their contract for franchise is revoked, the consumer can't do anything about it. 


I think we are a wasteful country, but you can't expect us to operate the same way that a country like Germany does.  In Germany you have a country about the size of Ohio with a lot more people.  Their transportation and government are set up differently.  You have government health care.  You have bus transportation even to the smallest towns.  Their taxes are astronomical, but you don't pay for health care out of your own pocket.  You get money every month for every child you have regardless of your income.  You can't expect a country as diverse as the U.S.  to be able to do what they are doing.  I don't agree with the bag tax.  I think they are using examples that just don't fit our economy.  I think this sets a dangerous precedent and I hope that they don't pass it.



__________________
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you do criticize them you will be a mile away and have their shoes.


2011 Super Bowl Champions!

Status: Offline
Posts: 29950
Date:

I agree, we are a wasteful country.  I still prefer the way they do it out in the country, just burning their trash (with the exception of the toxic stuff of course).


The thing is, for every action there's a reaction in the US, and everytime we consider doing something good there's SOMEONE out there who see's it as something bad.  So the easy thing to do is just keep adding taxes.


For example, President Bush has been getting serious about a flat tax, the tax code in this country is insane, and it would just make more sense to have either a flat tax or a national sales tax, but you KNOW that will never happen because a huge part of our economy is made up of accountants who rely on that complicated code to create a job for them.


I'm sure there's a bit of that in our trash problem, we view the various wrappers and stuff as trash, but to someone, it's their ENTIRE JOB, they just make the wrappers for a pack of Oscar Meyer weiners!


A sweeping change in the way we package products would hurts hundreds of thousands of people and businesses.


I dont' know what the answer is anymore, but I'd be willing to burn my trash in an incinerator :)



__________________


The Procrastinating Red-Head

Status: Offline
Posts: 1433
Date:

I live out in the country and we burn our burnable trash.  Lately, people have been putting ads in the paper about people burning their trash.  They want everyone to stop burning their trash because they say that doing so affects the people that have asthma.  I don't think there is a solution that everyone is going to be happy with.  It's like anything in America, if you do something SOMEONE is going to find fault with it.  But, that's one of the things that makes America great.  You have the right to have your own opinion about it and if you feel strongly enough about it, you can try and change.  God bless the U.S.A! 

__________________
Before you criticize someone, walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you do criticize them you will be a mile away and have their shoes.
Page 1 of 1  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.

Tweet this page Post to Digg Post to Del.icio.us


Create your own FREE Forum
Report Abuse
Powered by ActiveBoard